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SHY ( HARD TO FIND ) VEINS QUESTION


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#1 PAUL1942

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 12:54 PM

I am post 2 years for cabg x3 and i think that i am turning into a turnip. :(
"Can't get blood from a turnip". :)
The nurses are having a hard time finding my veins for drawing blood samples. The problem seems to be getting worse as time goes by. The other day the nurse tried 3 times with no success.
Now i have to go back again for another stab at it. :blue:
I am curious to know if this is a common event for us heart folks and if so what do you do about the problem. I am on lisinipril,lasix and atenolol plus prevacid and lipitor. THANKS PAUL
"Would you tell me ,please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to," said the Cat.
"I don't much care where --" said Alice.
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go," said the Cat.
"--so long as I get somewhere," Alice added as an explanation.
"Oh, you're sure to do that," said the Cat, "if you only walk long enough."
~ Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland

#2 Famulus

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 01:32 PM

Paul, I don't have this but a friend does - here are the rec's:

• wrap some hot towels around your arm beforehand
• keep squeezing a squeezeball to pump your veins
• drink extra water or gatorade so you are super-hydrated.

Also, don't hesitate to ask for the most experienced person in the lab.
I've waited behind people with this problem and it must be just miserable!
Hope it's easier next time!

Woops - forgot this -
Sit straight up in the chair so your heart is above your arm
Don't bend your arm - keep it straight out (downward slant) & make a fist - stay flexed...does that make sense?

(my friend is here, standing over my shoulder & now approves of these instructions :P )

Edited by Famulus, 20 November 2005 - 01:43 PM.


#3 gschmitt

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 01:57 PM

This is a big problem with me Paul. Ever since I got the ICD and some added meds for that I don't have anymore veins. Now if a nurse or tech gets blood from my in less than five sticks they go on my favorite sticker list. Usually they end up with a 20 gauge butterfly in the back of the hand. I've tried most of the tricks listed above but no help.
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#4 Renate

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 07:22 PM

Hi Paul,
I have the same problem. I especially was really bad all of last year when on Coumadin and I had to be picked twice a week. It sometimes took 4 picks and my veins turned black and blue.
I did all the things Famulus talked about. It worked sometimes, especially the hot towel. I finally found one lab technician who was better at it and I always waited for her (I still only go to her). They also can only use the smallest needle on me. It's much improved now without the Coumadin. It usually just takes 2 picks now. To get an IV started is another matter though. That is a real problem. I had a colonoscopy a month ago and 3 different nurses tried unsuccessfully. The doctor came in to start the colonoscopy and they still had not gotten the IV started. :common003[1]:

Renate

#5 heartangel

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 07:52 PM

Paul I have it too and also they run away so they used one on my hand. Yes ask for the most experienced person helps also use butterfly needles too helps alot too. And drink alot of water and yes ask to hold ands squueze a ball or t your fist. I am told by SID the one who does me if you know ahead of time drink alot of water water water then hold your hand in a fist and ask for a butterfly needle. last time they drew it from my hand and couldnot get an IV going for me last week either they all ran awy.LOl And I am serious but I kis them saying they are a saying enough is enugh no more . But yes Oona did give good things to do for i do that and I have a certain person do mine each time. It os very common too.
HOpe everyones suggestions help.
Heidi
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Mr.Craig Fulgate Head of EOC in FL. :)

#6 Gordspen

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Posted 20 November 2005 - 10:27 PM

Hello Paul and welcome to our home,

One thing that no one has mentioned is something we do not even consciously think about and it is simply that sub-consciously because of what we have experienced through nervousness our veins collapse whenever a needle is about to be used on us. :action-smiley-077: I also have a lot of problems whenever nurses or especially doctors, who are the worst people I have ever come across when it comes to getting blood from us or putting a cannula into us. At the hospital here near were I live there is one doctor who always uses the largest cannula type needle whenever he decides to put it into your veins and with him, I dread the thought and the pain is always terrible and my arm is sore until they take it out :sign19: . So subconsciously our bodies shut the veins down when they see some needle coming towards it. I have no fear of needles and find that before anyone comes near me I seem to have veins both in my hands and arms but as soon as that needle is on its way towards my body they just disappear. They then tell me I am thick skinned. :blowup: Whenever they take blood from me there seems to be only one place these days that they can successfully get it without the vein disappearing. The strange thing is I do not fear needles and have no problem either having them, or the veins being used to take blood. My doctor tells me it is something my body seems to have decided to reject maybe due to the fact that some medical staff are not very good at using needles. :signs045[1]:

The guys and Girls here have given you some good ideas but think about what I have said and you might just find that you are also similar to me in the way your body now reacts when a needle is about to enter it. :common003[1]: In fact Paul now the veins are there when I leave home until the next time I look when I arrive at the hospital and low and behold my veins have disappeared.

God bless and hopefully we will have helped a little with your question,

Gordon and Michelle
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#7 Denisefh

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 01:03 PM

I had the same problems for over a year after my heart surgery but it's gotten better now. They had to use butterfly needles and even then had a difficult time. Bob is a horrible stick because of all his years of Crohn's. He usually asks for the most experienced person and at times has had to have an arterial draw. He's tried all the tricks mentioned above and sometimes they work and sometimes they don't. He usually does best when he is warm, well rested and well hydrated...but that's a hard combo and also doesn't always work.
Good luck,
Denise
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#8 HalfWayToTheStars

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 01:28 PM

I used to have that problem; I remember they had to bring in a pro to get an IV line started once. I wasn’t cleaver enough to come up with the methods listed above. Often they do well finding a vein at the inside of the elbow. But just recently my veins have been popping out, very noticeable. I wonder if it has to do with doubling the lisinopril dose recently. My boyfriend says its because in old ladies like me the skin gets very thin so the veins are more visible. Where did I leave that doghouse?

#9 gschmitt

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 03:07 PM

From what I have seen there is no single type of person who has good veins or one that has bad veins. Some you can almost get a good stick every time and others like I have turned out to be are the ones that I dreaded the most. We carried butterfly needle but I never used one on a patient. The smallest I would use was an 18 guage and most of the time a 16. The 16 is a good size to move a lot of fluids and meds quickly. In the field for our paramedics any vein was fair game. Arm, hand, foot, neck or under the tongue, get the best one you can find at the time. I got to do a subclavian once in the field and used 14 for that one. We did carry 10 gauge needles but those were supposed to used for chest tubes.

I love needles as long as it's not my blood showing. I never could watch my own blood being taken and still can't. That will put me on the floor in an instant.
Life may not be the party we hoped for but while we're
here we should dance.

In heaven there is no beer
That's why we're drinking it here
And when we're gone from here
All our friends will be drinking all our beer.

Let the Gemutlichkeit roll on. Ein Prosit.

Life is too short to drink cheap beer.

Aerobics are for those who don't polka.

#10 HalfWayToTheStars

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 03:19 PM

Gilbert, it would floor me also; I too always look away. I worked for a dentist for a while and found I quickly got so looking at other people's procedures didn't bother me--that surprised me. I knew a women whose parents were in the undertaking business and they showed her the worst possible case to see if she could come into the business, she failed. But it seems to me that you could work up to worse and worse cases.

#11 Patoolla

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 04:52 PM

It's not as hard as it used to be to find a good vein to draw blood or for an IV. I was told once that when you have to have blood drawn of get an IV often that made it harder to find a vein that could be used. So when I was going to ER so often with my SVT along with getting blood drawn often for my RA it was awful every time they had to do it! During one SVT episode I had about 5 nurses trying and it took them over an hour and a half before one finally got it. Not counting the time the EMTs tried before transporting me to the hospital. The were just about ready to go for a vein in my neck when one of them got in one on my arm! And all this time my poor heart was beating well over 200 bpm! Not a fun time at all. Its a lot easier for them now since I'm not getting poked so often from the SVT episodes! Thank goodness. It does make a big difference on how experienced the person is doing it too. I swear, some of those nurses couldn't put in an IV on someone with huge veins! LOL

#12 PAUL1942

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Posted 21 November 2005 - 08:33 PM

Thanks for the help and tips. The nurse did try a hot pack, but that did not help. The nurse did say that there would be a more experienced nurse on hand when i go back in. It is hard to drink and hold a lot of liquids when you are on lasix. It is not going to happen. I am going to try not taking my meds. before i go to the clinic. The docs want a fasting blood count so i don't eat before i go. Again THANKS for your help. It is nice to know that it isn't just me. PAUL
"Would you tell me ,please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to," said the Cat.
"I don't much care where --" said Alice.
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go," said the Cat.
"--so long as I get somewhere," Alice added as an explanation.
"Oh, you're sure to do that," said the Cat, "if you only walk long enough."
~ Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland

#13 heartangel

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Posted 23 November 2005 - 03:06 PM

nope Paul it alot of us too. I hope this more experienced nurse can do it too best of luck and please let us know how it goes too.
Heidi
1.Take care of yourself
2.Take care of others
3. Take care of yourself
Mr.Craig Fulgate Head of EOC in FL. :)

#14 Kathlyn1950

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Posted 25 November 2005 - 12:33 PM

Before my MI I had great veins for pokin'. LOL. The ones in my arms stood right up. For some reason, since the heart attack, they are not visible at all. The first time I noticed was during the MI. The nurse finally had to put it not where my arm bends but somewhere (I can't even remember most of what happened now) on my arm. They manage to find my veins now, but they have to look really good. I can't see them.

#15 PAUL1942

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Posted 25 November 2005 - 03:12 PM

Mission accomplished. The more experienced nurse did the job with 1 stick. :D PAUL
"Would you tell me ,please, which way I ought to go from here?"
"That depends a good deal on where you want to get to," said the Cat.
"I don't much care where --" said Alice.
"Then it doesn't matter which way you go," said the Cat.
"--so long as I get somewhere," Alice added as an explanation.
"Oh, you're sure to do that," said the Cat, "if you only walk long enough."
~ Lewis Carroll, Alice's Adventures in Wonderland